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Re: [amsat-bb] Re: Loose lips sink ships, etc.

>From: Jon Ogden <na9d@mindspring.com>
>To: Dave Guimont <dguimon1@san.rr.com>, Robert Oler <cvn65vf94@msn.com>
>CC: <amsat-bb@AMSAT.Org>
>Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: [sarex] Loose lips sink ships, etc.
>Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2001 22:51:26 -0500

>Mr. Oler, thinks he knows how to do space stuff better than anyone else.
>His opinion - not mine.

This thread should probably die and I am tempted to let your post go and 
would have except for the last sentence.  This is a public board and one 
cant let things like your last sentence go "unchallenged" because I dont 
want that post coming up to me one day in some hearing or other venue and 
having to knock down something I DIDNT say.

That sentence is a statement of your opinion and I am quite surethat you 
cannot find a quote where I stated that either on this BBS or in the 
plethora of professional pubs I have been in on space policy in this country 
(The Weekly Standard, Space news...to name two there are others) nor in any 
venue of public record.

I am quite certian that almost anyone could do "space stuff" (if you mean 
the space station) better then the folks at NASA who are in charge of it now 
but then so could Larry, Moe, and Joe.  Anyone who has a project that has 
spent 16 billion in the last 8 years and announces that they are 4 billion 
and climbing over budget is demonstrably incompetent.  They have either 
misestimated the task or dont know how to do the task.  As a paren the 
"parts" of the space station that have underperformed and over cost are 
MOSTLY US and Russian stuff.  The Destiny module is an excellent example.  
1.4 billion for basically an empty shell.  To give you some comparison...A 
LA attack sub (which has more wiring more networks etc) goes for about that. 
  Why do you think that is?

The folks who have develiverd on time and on budget are well the ITalians.

Having said that I dont think you will find the quote that you attribute to 
me...so really thats your opinion of what I have said and thats fine but 
then again thats your opinion....not my words.  They are your words.  Thats 
what I wanted to get "on the record" for the future.  You be careful with my 
words...I'll be careful with yours.

So while we are here.

IN the end it doestn matter how many taxes you pay.   The tax schedule in 
this country is such that we basically all "pay" according to our means so 
we all have a stake in how and what is spent and wheather I disagreed or 
agreed with a program WOULD probably bias wheather or not I would consider 
incompetence accpetable.  If I "cared" about something I would consider 
incompetence unacceptable.  (of course having said that I really dont mind 
paying taxes for the whole show...we are a great nation and we are that way 
in no small measure because the government has enormous resources).  I care 
about space and a space future so that it is done so ineptly (the station 
will cost this country over 100 billion dollars...the shuttle has flown for 
20 years and accomplished NOTHING near its cost) pains me. (so I wont bother 
telling you that if you are saddened by how much you pay then you probably 
wouldnt want to write the "checks" I have written last year and will write 

Now to the BBS part.  In the end the ham station on board ISS is justified 
by NASA mostly as a "inspire our youth" program which is what they say when 
they want to cover PR efforts.  That Ham contacts mayhave individual 
"success" is probably true BUT even if there was a ham contact two times a 
day they wouldnt finish the schools in Texas in a year and so the 
inspiration on a "per dollar per child" basis is pretty weak.  What has a 
far more serious impact on "our youth" being inspired would be having decent 
teachers and decent aides in all the schools.  I am where I am and who I am 
because of hard work on my part...but because of teachers and mentors who 
along the way challenged and pushed and prodded and kept me going when it 
would have been easy to stop.  NOt because of the Apollo landings.

NASA wanted to fly a "all female shuttle" along the same exact lines that 
they justify Ham radio...which is to say babble for PR.  It would be 
interesting to know exactly what has beeen spent on the ham station up in 
the station?  I think I can find that out...

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