[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next] - [Date Index][Thread Index][Author Index]

Re: Fw: ELK or ARROW



To All,
1. Amateur Radio is learning by doing.
2. A large amount of data on Yagi type antennas exists, easily found, and is
well proven. 
3. Several design programs for antennas exist reducing construction time and
waist of materials.
4. Equipment to measure comparative antenna performance at VHF/UHF
frequencies is not hard to find.

Why do we line the pockets of some poorly designed antenna manufacturing
companies instead of learning how and making the best performing antennas
for our own use? If we do not learn these skills, no one will be left to
teach and the skills will be lost. 

There are many older Amateurs willing to teach those that want to learn, and
hopefully many of those wanting to learn are at least one half of the age of
those who can teach!

Art,
KC6UQH

-----Original Message-----
From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On
Behalf Of Jim Danehy
Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:33 PM
To: amsat-bb@amsat.org
Subject: [amsat-bb] Fw: ELK or ARROW


.  there is the old adage that you get what you pay for . . . why buy a 
poorly designed antenna that does not work very well
> ?
>
> If you have a 5 element  yagi that only produces 4 dbi you are not getting

> what you paid for . . . most 2 element yagis would out perform that 
> statistic . . . a 5 element yagi should be at least 9 db + or 10 db dbd 
> (dipole ) not isotropic  . . . . there is something that is called 
> MERCHANTABILITY . . .i.e., an IMPLIED WARRANTY  that you are getting at 
> least the minimum for your money . . .
> 4 dbi for an Arrow is way off base . . .  so it is not just ; you can not 
> afford a Cadillac but you are not even getting a Ford or Chevy  . .  i.e.,

> the gain of a 5 element yagi on 435 mhz . . .  that is the issue, not cost

> alone . . . . . . same comments apply to the ELK but I have attempted to 
> make the point that there is a minimum performance for a certain number of

> elements that is pretty OBJECTIVE and when it is not met  . . . . well 
> that is my point . . . these two antennas have shown to some testers that 
> they do not measure up to the minimum EXPECTATIONS . . .unfortunately that

> is acceptable to some  . . . . then it becomes acceptable to many . . . 
> and objectivity is abandoned . . .
>
> Jim W9VNE
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Trey Brown" <palintheus@gmail.com>
> To: "Jim Danehy" <jdanehy@cinci.rr.com>
> Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] ELK or ARROW
>
>
>> Thanks for the comments. Realize, though, that not everyone wants or
>> can afford to have the Cadillac.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Jim Danehy <jdanehy@cinci.rr.com> wrote:
>>> the Arrow antenna has been critiqued by Kent Britain, WA5VJB
>>>
>>> http://wa5vjb.com/references/Cheap%20Antennas-LEOs.pdf
>>>
>>> he says that some have measured the Arrow for gain on 435 mhz @ 4 dbi 
>>> (isotropic) . . . . and that further analysis showed that for the 
>>> element lengths used on 435 mhz that it peaks at 457 mhz and not 435 mhz

>>> . . . Kent is a well respected VHF/UHF antenna person who has plenty of 
>>> credibility . . .
>>>
>>> Kent opines that the Arrow, as built does not have its elements 
>>> insulated from the boom. It uses dimensions for insulated elements . . .

>>> so much for the Arrow . . . .
>>>
>>> Now for the ELK  : a local friend of mine owns an Arrow and he uses it 
>>> successfully. He bought an ELK and attempted to compare the Arrow and 
>>> the ELK . . . . he could not make an across town QSO on 435 mhz from his

>>> second story window with the ELK , so he sent the ELK back for a refund 
>>> .
>>>
>>> I have worked and exchanged QSLs with several hundred satellite users . 
>>> . .the majority of the folks that have worked and QSLed me (close to 250

>>> + ) have been using either the Arrow or ELK based upon the information 
>>> on their cards. So they are popular. Are they optimum ? A lot of 
>>> anecdotal information would seem to say NO . . .
>>>
>>> Thirty-five years ago I worked Oscar 6 with a homebrew 2 mtr yagi that 
>>> probably was worse than either the Arrow or Elk but I worked YV and KL7 
>>> from Indiana on CW with about 15 watts to the 3 elements which my XYL 
>>> waved around at my directions . . . not any more . . .what do I use 
>>> these days : a pair of circular polarity yagis on 10 foot booms 
>>> manufactured by M Square . . . .
>>>
>>> Folks ask what should they buy ? Maybe a Ford or maybe a Chevy . . . 
>>> neither is a Cadillac . . . .
>>>
>>> Jim W9VNE
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite 
>>> program!
>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Trey -- N5THX
>>
>> They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
>> safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
>> - Benjamin Franklin
>>
> 

_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3719 (20081227) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3719 (20081227) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 

_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb



AMSAT Top AMSAT Home