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Re: Crossband repeat on ISS

Who is going to "syncronize" all this?  An NCS station has the same 10 
minutes that everyone else has via satelite to control the activity.  
How does the next NCS know when it is his/her turn to take over?  Who 
will hold the cell phone equiped browser for the 
HT-ARROW-TAPERECORDERLOGGING portable station that already does not have 
enough hands to hold the flashlight so it is "fair" for all wanting to 
get in?.  Who smacks the hand of the longwinded half-duplex user calling 
CQ SATELITE for ten minutes that has a bigger gun than either NCS in 

This thread makes for some good "talking points", and hopefully for the 
"newbies" subscribed to this list some education that will quicken the 
learning curve from newbie to successful satelite user.  I suspect when 
the holidays are over and the shear numbers of users shrink, it will be 
like AO-51, a lot easier to access now than a few months ago.  I sure 
have enjoyed my "learning curve" in 2005.  Since February, obtained 51 
on 51 #31.  It does not come easy for the newbies.

My two cents worth.


ps:  Bob, thanks for sharing APRS with the world!  I have copied your 
digi in Tidewater, Virginia direct via skip several times.  I go back to 
the days without NODES, IGATES, etc.  You had to know the path and type 
it to get out of town and hope the collisions were not a factor.  Six 
hop QSOs were difficult, but doable. ;-)

Robert Bruninga wrote:

>>>My opinion...[is] that we recognize the facts and 
>>>simply change our operating to match the situation. 
>>>[and operate as directed nets...]
>>I do remember that the directed nets on AO-40 and 
>>A0-13 went very orderly.  Again, the "Quick passes" 
>>of LEO's do not allow this sort of thing.
>Ah, but it depends on what is meant by "this sort of 
>thing".  If one's expectations are that a net control 
>will somehow be able to manage 100 checkins and let
>each one of them make a contact during 10 minutes, 
>then one is simply not understanding that this is impossible.
>The purpose of the directed net is to allow the resource
>to be used successfully and efficiently by a smaller 
>number but in a meaningful way.   THe status quo 
>has been to just let everyone of the 100 transmit
>williy-nilly in a congestion limited/power limited way
>so that nothing really gets communicated.  The result
>is only a few big guns get to say a few sentences.
>Lets say about a dozen are "successful" out of the
>100 trying.
>But the intelligence throughput is very low and the
>frustration is very high and it is only the big guns
>(usually) that get to use it at will.  The actual throughput
>of intelligence is on the order of 30% maybe.  All the
>rest of the time it is collisions with no one getting through.
>It is simply impossible to get 100 stations with success 
>anyway.  We must simply recognize that and re-define
>how the limited resource is used.
>But,  by having a net control managing who transmits,
>when, then the "success" rate of voice throughput
>should go up to say 90% (triple the throughput) and
>instead of meaningless disjoint snippets of half-completed
>QSO's, we would have a somewhat more meaningful
>dialogs to hear.   No, not everyone (of the 100) will
>be able to participate, but the few dozen that do, will 
>be heard and heard well without collisions, and will be 
>able to add intelligence to the net, rather than just 
>inserting their call into bedlam.
>It will be much more enriching and entertaining.  I 
>envision, net controls will think of all kinds of neat
>and entertaining things to do.  They will go to special
>places to operate portable, or will have specialty 
>checkins.  Could even do some SSTV, or call for
>antique car checkins, or handheld-only passes.
>Special events would be routine from school demos
>to scout meetings to operating from a canoe.
>The bottom line is that instead of hearing senseless
>babble from bedlam, the passes would be fun and
>entertaining to LISTEN TO, and challenging and
>exciting to set up.  And users would respect it because
>HAM radio knows how to operate a directed net.
>There is only one simple  rule to follow, and that is
>not to transmit until invited.  Done.
>Yet, it is egalitarian, since anyone from a big-gun
>to a handheld can sign up to be netcontrol for any 
>given pass and HE can define how that pass will
>operate and everyone can see in advance what
>may be of interest to them, or just tune in and
>listen to ham radio at its finest.
>de Wb4APR, Bob
>Sent via amsat-bb@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
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Sent via amsat-bb@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
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