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Re: NCS for ISS/FM leo sat's

>>> "Greg Wycoff" > 01/01/06 9:12 PM >>>
>Bob my point is if somebody hears a grid/state that 
>they need or an operator is operating from a rare 
>grid locator then why should they need a hallway 
>pass to work it.

Because that is the cause of the problem.  If such
people just jump in and keep keying up trying to get 
in and collide with everyone then no one gets in.
Also, if the rare person or grid is involved in a QSO or
something else, it is not courteous to bust in just
to make a contact.

Now if the purpose of that particular pass and net-control
is to help people chase grids, then of course such
people are welcome to jump in when the net control
calls for people wanting to make that grid.  But if the
purpose of that particular pass is to let kids at a school
make some contacts, then it is not courteous to
jump in and step on them.

>a NCS works great on a HEO satellite as you have time 
>to take check ins and can pass it around and you have 
>the band width, but you are talking about a 
>8 to 10 minute window not worth it.

All the more reason to organize it and make it more
efficient.... Is it "worth it" for 7 out of those 10 minutes
to hear *nothing* but sylables and pieces of calls
due to all the collisions, and no one makes a contact
except the 5 big guns who have already worked
each other on most passes?  Or is it "worth it" for
a reasonable number of stations to operate in a
civilized manner for all the footprint to hear?

Sure, net-control operation will not let 100 people
make lots of contacts in 8 to 10 minutes, but 
neither will the current free-for-all.  But even
with big guns and the status-quo, how many full 
contacts are made?  5?  a dozen?  I certainly
have never heard more than a dozen or so
successful two-ways in one pass.

Now, operate as a directed net, and I bet we will
see a *lot* more successful two-way contacts on
each pass.  Still not 100, and still not everyone
will get in, but those that do *on that pass* will
be heard and will not be stepped on.

Although  "everyone" -individually- will get to TX less 
under the directed net approach, "everyone" will have
a better overall experience  in the long run.

Just a perspective.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga@usna.edu>
To: <amsat-bb@amsat.org>
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] NCS for ISS/FM leo sat's

>>>> "Greg Wycoff" <<1/01/06 8:03 PM >>>
>>Having a NCS for the ISS repeater or a FM satellite.
>>What a stupid idea, ...give up the idea of grid square
>>chasing or looking for that state they need for WAS,
> I think you missunderstand the concept.  None of that
> has to be given up.  If people want to chase grid squares,
> just reserve as many passes as you want for grid
> square chasing and operate the entire pass inviting rare
> grids to check in.  In otherwords, no matter what activity
> you want to do, reserve the bird for that purpose and
> then you will be able to do *that activity* better and
> more efficiently during *that* pass.
>>or just the simple idea of saying hi to a friend.
> If you want to say hi to  afriend, then reserve a pass
> and then you can be sure he can get back to you and
> won't be blocked by all the contention.
>>we went thru all this when AO-51 first went active
>>everyone said they could not work it and gave up
>>and was mad at everyone that could.
> Just think of it this way.  The reserved-directed-net
> approach simply replaces the "contention" from the RF
> uplink by moving the "contention"  over to the
> "reservation list"...
> There will still be contention, and debate and arguments
> over what part of ham radio is better than what
> other part, and who is doing what to whom, or who is
> being fair, but at least that squabling is not done in
> the blind by overload on the uplink.  It is done on
> the web.
> While the squabbling will continue (on the reservation
> list) at least those that respect the directed-net
> concept will have an efficient use of the transponder
> for their 10 minutes of reserved activity.  I would
> expect to see lots of special events... and grid chasing
> and just about everything else.  AND you can plan
> on it by checking the list to see what is the focus
> of a given pass.
> Or just listen and respond in kind when invited to
> transmit.
> de Wb4APR, Bob
> ----
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