Re: [amsat-bb] eagle costs

[Chris N1ZPP <n1zpp_amsat@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

non-"space certified" parts = $1000 satellite.

"space certified" parts = $100,000 satellite.

Given the track record, the $100,000 satellite is bound to fail anyway. 
So do we launch 1 of those, or 100 of the cheaper version sats for the
same cost?  I bet on the 100 cheaper sats built with off-the-shelf
parts.  Probability dictates that at least a couple of 'em are going to
work.

Speaking of cheap satellite experiments... Stensat made it on the
cheap.  Too bad it didn't work ... try again though!  Any satellite,
cheap or not, is not guaranteed to work.  I'd launch a couple of
Stensats before making a judgement call against non-space rated parts.

Best,
--Chris
//N1ZPP


On Fri, 2004-09-03 at 21:53, Gould Smith wrote:
> Hello Patrick,
> 
> If you are really interested, there is a section in the ECHO book on some of
> the major areas that go into matching the batteries.  I had always been
> curious about this, and included it because I though others would find it
> interesting.  The batteries off the shelf are not terribly expensive,
> getting 6+ to match very closely is a different story.  Time-Effort-Money
> 
> Space certification for parts requires that they undergo many tests on the
> ground and that they have have been proven to operate in space.  It is an
> inexperienced person that bets the farm on an inexpensive part, to save
> money.
> Considering the time and effort to build and test, not to mention launch a
> satellite and expect a 5+ year lifetime,
> riding on the failure of a cheap unqualified part, is certainly not the way
> to manage a project.
> 
> The thing I think people keep forgetting, we can't put it on the bench and
> fix it, like we do so often to so many things here on Earth.  Building
> something both electrical and mechanical that works continuously for 5 years
> without repair is a very, very difficult undertaking.
> 
> Regards,
> Gould
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Patrick Green" <pagreen@gmail.com>
> To: "Public Mail List amsat-bb" <amsat-bb@AMSAT.Org>
> Sent: Friday, September 03, 2004 7:58 PM
> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] eagle costs
> 
> 
> > To add to the below:  Why do things that are "space certified" so
> > expensive?  I would like to know more on the subject of batteries.
> > These are the things that seem to be the most sensitive of the whole
> > package.
> >
> > 73 de Pat --- KA9SCF.
> >
> >
> > On 03 Sep 2004 18:49:05 -0400, Chris N1ZPP <n1zpp_amsat@snowjournal.com>
> wrote:
> > > This is an interesting subject and something I've thought a lot about
> > > for a while now.
> > >
> > > For those of us that don't understand the all the details involved, why
> > > exactly does a "cheap" satellite cost $110k?  Unless I'm missing
> > > something, I'd think one could pull together the right parts for under
> > > $5k.
> > >
> > > So, where's the cost?  Do those guys in dust suits cost a lot of money?
> > > Do the vibration tests cost a lot of money?  Does the launch cost a lot
> > > of money?  If an amateur satellite could fly on a commercial load as
> > > balast, why does it cost much of anything?
> > >
> > > How about this for cost... What about flying a small sat into orbit atop
> > > an amateur rocket?  I bet there's an amateur rocket group somewhere out
> > > there chomping at the idea of being the first amateur group to put a
> > > satellite in orbit.  So why not team up?  Lets see if an amateur
> > > satellite could be built for under $10k and launched on an amateur
> > > rocket for very little cost.  $25k for the whole project, or am I being
> > > naive?
> > >
> > > --N1ZPP
> > > //Chris
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, 2004-09-03 at 13:53, wa6fwf wrote:
> > > > Hi All,
> > > >    having read the latest journal and taking note of Robins
> "guesstimate"  of
> > > > the 3 million dollar price tag of EAGLE, I had to wonder that if we
> cant
> > > > raise 110k for ECHO how are we possibly going to do this?
> > > >
> > > >    I can only hope that cheaper launch possibilities are being persued
> or that
> > > > we might luck out a get a discounted or free ride from our non-profit
> > > > status...
> > > >
> > > >   Another possibility is that everyone at a minimum joins up and
> becomes a
> > > > member if they are not already one and would consider making a
> donation on
> > > > top of their membership.
> > > >
> > > >    I'm not sure that Robins suggestion of making the membership fees
> $150
> > > > would fly very far...  but the point is taken... if you want a sat the
> money
> > > > has to come from somewhere.....
> > > >
> > > >   The only other alternative would be to downsize Eagle with maybe
> just mode
> > > > L/S and drop anything else off, (I picked that mode since a lot of
> people
> > > > already have  the mode S equipment from ao40 and L up was becoming
> popular,
> > > > but mostly because the antennas are kept small), just keep it small,
> simple
> > > > and cheap and then less weight means  a cheaper launch....
> > > >
> > > >     Maybe a less desirable orbit but a simpler cheaper solid fuel
> boost?
> > > >
> > > > Anyone else have any ideas how we can get this show on the road?
> > > >
> > > > 73
> > > > Kevin
> > > > WA6FWF
> > > > #19623
> > > > ----
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