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Re: ECHO Voice operations



>>> Emily Clarke <w0eec@AMSAT.Org> 7/30/04 12:24:50 PM >>>
>I would be against this.... trying to do it on a single channel 
>FM satellite, while seeming idealistic and feasible, seems 
>to be a simple answer to a complex issue (human nature).

I think I can offer some amplifying remarks::

1)  I would argue that it is a -simple- answer but it is also
a -simple- problem too.  Only one person can talk at a time 
on an FM net and that is what Directed nets have always 
been about solving.

2)  If we never do organized nets, then we are saying that
ECHO and FM satellites are only CONTEST birds and
have no other purpose because we are training everyone
to just continue with the status quo.

3)  If we never do organized nets and let the users learn
that the VOICE transponder is ONLY for a free-for-all zoo,
then that is what we will always get.  And then we will
-never- be able to use it for anything else (Formal demos,
Emergency Comms, whatever) beacuse the users wont
know how to react.   People dont like change or surprises.

4)  We need to accustom users to the fact that there
MAY BE TIMES when free-for-all operation is not desired
and that ONE OF THE CRITERIA FOR OPERATING
is to be aware of the schedule and/or to listen first.

After 10+years of operating the voice birds with aboslutely 
no planning, discipline, specific purpose or organized plan,
I think it is time for AMSAT to try something else for a change.

Now I am ALL FOR routine operations just like now, they 
are fun and enjoyable, and I think they can continue...but we 
must also set aside time and  discipline ourselves to allow 
for other possibilities sometimes.

When I say a directed net, please don't think in terms of the 
typical long-winded directed nets one may have heard on 
other frequencies.  Instead a 20 minute coast-to-coast NET 
will require modified or accellerated techniques:

*) Each such net should plan on two-net controls, one to 
begin the net and one at the other end of the country to
end it, tailored to the pass geometry.

*)  The purpose of a net can be just about anything, but
with the WEB page, the AMSAT-BB and the digital downlink
everyone has amble opportunity to be aware of what
the particular net or topic might be for any given pass in
advance.  or if it is available for zoo operations...

But the bottom line is that the NET CON always LEADS who
talks next.   SO that communications is -successful- not just
lots of random calls and lucky hits in the ether.

Such a net control would have looked at the map and
be aware of the geography of the pass for example a
south to north east coast pass.  He might say
ANY EMERGENCY OR PRIORITY TRAFFIC?:
ANY FORMAL OR GROUP DEMOS?:
ANY FLORIDA CHECKINS....
ANY SOUTH CAROLINA?...
ANY NORTH CAROLINA?...
ANY MIDATLANTIC?
etc...
HANDING OVER TO XXXX NETCON IN BOSTON:
etc...

Since everyone is listening FULL DUPLEX he does not
need to ROGER each checkin.  ALso NO PHONETICS, 
NO SPELLINGS, just rapid fire  talk.

They can be short 4 second checkins just for making
contacts, or they can be by area, region, whatever.
Or can be taking reports of other kinds.

OR SCHOOLS!  Let a school sign up to be NET-CON
for a pass (kinda like with ARISS).  The school is
just one-half of the QSO throughout the pass.  THey
can talk about anything, but all people checking in
are talking to that school, unless otherwise directed.
etc...  (but doing it like we do now is more often a 
"negative" demo of how not-to-comunicate....)

Some occasional net-style operating will require good net 
controls with  good skills.  And there are some very good 
operators out there with these skills... that are a joy to
just listen to.  We all could learn...

>Before you go off and try to enforce a net structure on 
>Echo, I would propose you first demonstrate that you can 
>do so on FO-29 first.

That wont work, because demonstrating a directed net
when there are no checkins wont prove anything.. hi hi...

Anyway, I would sure like to hear one of our community's
great operators get on there and just take control once
in a while.  In fact, sometimes it does happen when there
is a rare station,  He just works like a contestor and
runs the frequency most of the pass.  And the neat thing
is that MORE PEOPLE ACTUALLY COMPLETE successful 
QSO's  in this situation in total then would have occured 
otherwise...

Problem is, he gets branded as a LID or selfish.  Where in
fact, he did most people a favor.  I'd just like to *occassionally*
see that happen but within the context of a purpose and
the support of the community...

Just some thoughts.  Bob, WB4APR

At 09:20 AM 7/30/2004 -0400, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>After a few weeks of the initial voice free-for-all on
>ECHO, I would again like to propose that eventually we
>plan for a few passes per week of operating some more
>organized directed nets.
>
>They can be AMSAT nets, DX nets, County Nets,
>Traveler Nets,  any topic, or just someone to make
>occasional order out of chaos.   We have now had 10
>years of open free-for-alls on the voice birds.  lets try
>something new on some days.  What we have today
>that we did not have 10 years ago is the global WEB
>so that such a schedule would be available to most ops.
>
>AND because ECHO has a simultaneous digital
>downlink, the same satellite can send down its schedule
>in APRS format to appear on the front panel of all
>compatible radios EVEN while a pass is in progress!
>
>I would propose an automatic WEB based sign-up
>sheet where NET-CONTROLS can sign up for a
>given pass.  Not all passes, but those that are
>designated for NET operation.  This file is also
>updated regularly on the birds BBS system.
>
>One example would be to guarantee good performance
>for those rare demos when someone is at a Satellite
>Meeting or Venue where he needs to show-off ECHO,
>but not be embarassed by the normal free-for-all style
>operating.  These occasions are known in advance.
>
>All the ECHO team would have to do is to pre-set
>which passes are for NET operation, and then it
>would be self running by the automated WEB page.
>Or I am sure a volunteer would be happy to help
>negotiate conflicts.
>
>HAM radio operators all know how a directed net
>works and all know how it facilitates order out of
>chaos.  Lets show our abilities to do it that way once
>in a while...  And demo some good practical
>applications for this new bird in HAM radio.
>
>Probably the first thing we would need to get this
>going would be a volunteer benevlolent dictator
>to take charge.  He could do it by Email on the
>AMSAT-BB for starters.
>
>de WB4APR, Bob
>----
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---------------------------------
W0EEC - CM87tm
AMSAT Area Coordinator - San Francisco Bay Area
http://www.projectoscar.net    http://www.PlanetEmily.com 
http://www.emilyshouse.com/experthams/ao7/ 

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---------------------------------  
----
Sent via amsat-bb@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the
author.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe amsat-bb" to Majordomo@amsat.org
----
Sent via amsat-bb@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
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