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Re: [officers] Membership DIRECTED survey



All,

As an officer of AMSAT, I do read -BB and SAREX on a regular basis.

Luc, I have read your e-mail below as well as your past e-mails.  I 
distinctly remember the substantial number of e-mails you sent to the SAREX 
reflector complaining about me, my so-called inabilities, and the lack 
of  packet ops on ISS.

I am all for a healthy debate.  And I believe that those on this reflector 
are not shy about holding a debate.  However,  I want to remind everyone 
that this is a volunteer organization.  When you bash people and 
organizations day-after-day one thing will happen.....they will leave.  Why 
put up with the abuse.  This includes the AMSAT volunteers, AMSAT itself, 
the space agencies (that launch our satellites) and those who are 
interested in what we do.

Luc, I will not pick apart your e-mail item by item, but I am intrigued by 
two items in this:

5- If the board wants to know the non active and non operating sat users 
opinions on what  AMSAT-NA should
do about satellite uses and operation? I think they should made TWO 
distinct focused group one for THE
"MONEY" CLASS ONE  and the other for THE SECOND CLASS "THE SAT OPERATORS 
THE USERS.

6 and 7- Dues paying members are all that count..-Membership support is 
what pays the bills.... FORGET THE
REST if whats i read and  whats i understand is correct i know a good bunch 
of LIFE MENBERS AND REGULAR
MEMBERS WHO WILL RESIGN THEIR MEMBERSHIP SOON.


Luc---you are saying two important things here:

1) in #5 you imply that satellite users do not put money into the 
satellites and that they are second class citizens

2)  in # 6 and 7 you imply that only dues paying members count.

Well,  I am not a financial wizard.  But I do know one thing.  If people do 
not pay dues to AMSAT or donate to AMSAT, there will be NO satellites for 
the satellite users.  It is that simple.  A survey is not needed if that is 
the perception and belief.

If you all on -bb share in this perception, then it is time for AMSAT to 
close shop.  But if you want satellites (of any kind), then I think you 
better look hard on whether you have done your part in 
contributing.  Otherwise AMSAT will die.

Second, you need to understand that I do not see satellite operators as 
second class citizens.  I do not know where you get that perception.  AMSAT 
builds satellites so that they can be operated.  My association with the 
board (for over 12 years now) convinces me that they are committed to the 
operators.  So I just don't understand this.  Yes, there is a debate out 
there on where AMSAT should invest its resources (money, time and 
talent).  That is what the survey is attempting to determine.  But, as I 
said, if there is no money into AMSAT, the amateur radio satellites and 
amateur radio operations will go away.

As Rodney King once said "Why can't we all get along?"  Let's get beyond 
bashing others and their initiatives.  We all like satellites.  Let's make 
satellites happen!!  But remember.....that takes money, time and talent.

73,

Frank Bauer, KA3HDO


At 01:43 AM 4/26/2004 -0400, you wrote:

>I was also busy... and i just take few minutes to pointed out some 
>comments of Mr Meisse message. I take out
>8 points that i comment and questionned below.
>
>
>On 23 Apr 2004 at 12:28, Gunther Meisse wrote:
>
>1- One must select randomly from the universe that is being studied... If 
>you leave it to volunteer
>respondents, the results are severely skewed and the process is statically
>  of no value.
>
>2- We selected 400 names from our paid membership roles.
>
>3- 250 respondents is critical mass,
>
>4-because we are surveying a focused group, not an open universe, which 
>would include persons totally
>  disinterested in the subject matter...
>
>5- Regarding the issue that some members are not operating satellite users:
>  This is a distinct possibility but their views are as valid as anyone else's
>  since they represent some portion of our dues paying members...
>
>6-Dues paying members are all that count... It is that money that allows 
>us to do what we
>do... Operating the birds means nothing...
>
>7-Membership support is what pays the bills....
>
>8- In closing, I will tell you that, when competed, we will have a wonderful
>  planning tool for your Board of Directors. Results that may well dispel old
>  myths, and give us the necessary information to make AMSAT-NA more focused
>  on the needs and wishes of the membership....
>
>
>
>  1- How and who is selecting randomly? Pick an choose! draw! Computer 
> randomly generating membership number
>or picked from a fish bowl ?
>
>
>2-Again "we selected" on what criterias?  how a selection can cope with 
>"random selection"?
>    Should we understand this survey as oriented towards A PECULIAR 
> membership type?
>
>3-250 members that WE SELECTED FROM A FOCUSED GROUP! whats the board wants 
>to tell the OTHERS or wants to
>hear to comfort them? considering that "OPERATING THE BIRDS MEANS 
>NOTHING"... I know that dues paying members
>are all that counts and it seems it is ONLY THAT WHO COUNTS... bring the 
>money in and shut your XYZ mouth.
>US THE BOARD we  know whats its the common wealth for you all. After all 
>operating the birds means nothing
>all we need its your money and we will select in our survey a focused 
>number of supporting members who are
>never operating on any sats. There is now two new members class THE 
>OPERATING ONES AND THE PAYING ONES!
>
>4-Surveying a focused group of persons totally disinterested in the 
>subject matter... i understand satellite
>    operators THE NEW AMSAT-NA SECOND CLASS MEMBERS!!!! The bad ones... 
> who unfortunatly are operating
>satellites and probably expressing their feelings about how things are 
>manadge in a way to improve their
>satellites uses and operation?
>
>If it is the definition of "randomly selected" it is a restrictive as the 
>universe that is being studied...
>The choosen universe! As i already wrote  "A safe way to heaven for the 
>choosen goes by accepting 50% of our
>mistakes first and by admitting the other 50% after. This survey seems to 
>be a variation on a same subject, a
>way around problems and truth . A national investigating board where 
>recommendations will be put on the
>shelves. That's looks good...
>
>5- If the board wants to know the non active and non operating sat users 
>opinions on what  AMSAT-NA should
>do about satellite uses and operation? I think they should made TWO 
>distinct focused group one for THE
>"MONEY" CLASS ONE  and the other for THE SECOND CLASS "THE SAT OPERATORS 
>THE USERS.
>
>6 and 7- Dues paying members are all that count..-Membership support is 
>what pays the bills.... FORGET THE
>REST if whats i read and  whats i understand is correct i know a good 
>bunch of LIFE MENBERS AND REGULAR
>MEMBERS WHO WILL RESIGN THEIR MEMBERSHIP SOON.
>
>8-In closing, I will tell you that, when competed, we will have a wonderful
>  planning tool for your Board of Directors. Results that may well dispel old
>  myths....DISPEL OLD MYTHS
>
>Mr. Meisse please enlighten us with the truth YOUR TRUTH?  Explain us 
>whats you mean about OLD MYTHS which
>ones? are they convey by OLD MEMBERS...? former OLD BOD MEMBERS? or the 
>ones dispel by the ones who their
>satellite operating means nothing AS AMSAT-NA seems to qualified them now?
>
>You make this survey to chase OLD MYTHS... Better to call Ghost 
>Busters!  since AMSAT-NA begining
>the membership wants to have satellites in first place. Why  for god sake 
>the board wants to survey the
>membership? what they want to know? MEMBERSHIPS WANTS SATELLITES period. 
>Puts all your money and ressources
>towards this goal. Whats you should survey its your manadgment. How it is 
>run. You are going backwards or you
>are playing the ostrich game in diverting attention with your survey.
>
>I adrressed this message to the AMSAT-NA BOD is it the way we should 
>understand the greatly needed changes in
>AMSAT-NA way to do business for the next years?  I mean doing things from 
>results based on a crappy and
>obviously  misleading  and apparently non democratic survey?
>
>The way this survey is conducted is in the exact AMSAT-NA culture.  BOD 
>members does not read messages on
>AMSAT-BB   and they fabricated faked survey to comfort their inactions 
>relying on comments of non sat users.
>They don't listen their members, they don't wants to be questionned about 
>what they do.
>
>I'M WRONG could be! Quote him out of context could be! Let Mr Meisse 
>clarify himself. We will see if BOD is
>sharing his comments after.
>
>I quote Robin Haighton VE3FRH President AMSAT-NA in his  president's april 
>letter:
>
>"The AMSAT Strategic Planning committee is working to develop a more
>effective means of operating the organization, and to provide 
>improved  communications
>between the Board of Directors, the Officers and the  Members.
>A new "Team approach" is being developed"
>
>"WE TRY HARD BUT IT NOT MATTER WE FAILED" Is it the conclusion we should 
>draw from this "new team approach"?
>I hope not!  better to clear that in first place. BTW it will be 
>interresting to see all the questions on
>this survey? could be we can see HOW DIRECTED THE QUESTIONS ARE!
>
>It looks like an old black and white film where a banana republic dictator 
>has been elected by 99% of all
>voters. He was the only one candidate and called his election free and 
>democratic...The remaining 1% seems
>the ones Mr. Meisse does not want to hear...i wrote Mr. Meisse here on 
>purpose should i wrote something else
>Mr. Haighton? I'm remember now it was a Charlie Chaplin film.or back to 
>future? anyway it not matter here.
>
>Mr Meisse its time for you to explain yourself and please read back the 
>letter you wrote and send us all in
>the pre AMSAT BOD election campaign period . Correct me if i'm not 
>interpreting you correctly? If it is a bad
>choice of words please correct them now.
>
>You can filled up a suitcase but i don't have any handle in my back... 
>Confucious saying.
>
>P.S. Since the demise of AO-40 i'm no more an active sat operator. I want 
>to applied to the new AMSAT first
>class of members. Aside of money there is any others requirements to 
>fulfill? I can sworn also that i will
>keep my mouth shut ;)
>
>Luc Leblanc VE2DWE
>Coordonnateur AMSAT pour le QuÈbec
>Quebec AMSAT coordinator
>AMSAT MEMBER (33583)
>Sorel-Tracy VE2CBS ARC President
>Sites web sites: www.qsl.net/ve2dwe
>                           www.sorel-tracy.qc.ca/~luclebla/
>
>Echolink node 115340 VE2DWE-L
>Echolink node 101810 VE2DWE
>
>P.O. Box 341
>Sorel-Tracy  QC.
>Canada
>J3P 5T6
>
>Due to spam mail proliferation The following extensions are automaticly 
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>
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>----
>Via the officers mailing list at AMSAT.ORG courtesy of AMSAT-NA.


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