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Re: was TS-2000X, now AO-40 lids

on 2/4/03 9:44 AM, Andrew Glasbrenner at glasbrenner@mindspring.com wrote:

> You don't know what you are missing because you've never heard it. And you
> won't realize this fact until you throw that BBQ in the trash. I have used
> that setup, and lots of other guys have and either moved to something bigger,
> or gave up. I prefer they move to something bigger.

So you are telling me what I can and cannot hear?  I just LOVE it.  You've
not even acknowledged the fact that I have stated I receive the beacon very
strong.  And if most of the guys then are 20 or 30 dB below the beacon, then
I wouldn't hear them.  You are probably a great armchair quarterback during
the football season as well.

>> I never said the satellite noise floor.  I am talking about my >noise
>> floor.
>> And if there are stations who are just above the satellite >noise floor,
>> then
>> they are running too little power, IMHO.
> No. They are obeying FCC law. Run the mininum power needed to maintain
> communications. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah.  Boy Scouts.  I love how people get preachy about that FCC
statement.  You must be an HF QRP operator as well.  They like to get on
their high horses and get on us who run amplifiers on HF.

>> The CW shouldn't pump the AGC like it does.  That's one of my >points in
>> that
>> I think the U band receive just doesn't perform as well as L >band.
> The fact remains that it does pump the AGC, and the only resaon they have to
> be so loud is that they cannot hear themselves, or the person they are working
> can not hear.

You simply are denying the facts here.  Why does the L band AGC not pump
even though the L band operators tend to be much stronger?  Huh?  Look at
the telemetry numbers.  The U band just doesn't perform as well and I'm not
the only one with that opinion.  CW signals tend to be relatively strong in
a very narrow bandwidth.  They should not pump a good AGC.  And if the
AGC/Leila were working totally like they should, then the SSTV signals
should get notched, and they typically don't.  To not acknowledge these
facts is to hide one's head in the sand in righteous self indignation.

>> How are you measuring the +/- 3 dB?  By ear?  Pretty hard to do >or do you
>> have test equipment.  And as for the don't hear Leila thing, I >find that
>> hard to believe.  Most satellite rigs don't have super great >filtering.
>> Besides Leila notches your signal so even if you don't hear the >tones, you
>> should be able to hear that your downlink is not there.
> It's easy to tell with a step attenuator and not much else. I can tell you
> haven't actually been on AO-40 much. Leila notches a fairly wide swath, bad
> enough that it can go off, notch your signal, and not even be heard on SSB.

Blah blah blah.  Every time I've heard it go off with one exception, I have
heard the tones.  The other night it notched a carrier not far away from me.
I was still able to hear myself even though I was notched.  The guy I was
working told me he heard a strong signal not far from us and Leila was
notching him.  Amazing!  I was able to hear myself on a BBQ dish while
having my signal fall w/in the skirts of Leila's notch!  I thought I wasn't
supposed to be able to hear with a BBQ dish?

>> Yet why am I even talking and discussing this.  I obviously >can't hear a
>> damn thing on AO-40 according to all you experts and so I must >be one of
>> these lids!  Cripe.  What a great way to encourage people to >use the bird.
> You are the one saying that a mediocre receive system is fine, not me. If the
> shoe fits, wear it. I think we do a great disservice encouraging people to
> limp along barely able to hear the bird and messing it up for other folks
> because their receive system stinks. I cannot count the number of times lately
> on AO-40 that I've been in the middle of a QSO and had some deaf station start
> calling CQ right on top of me because he can't hear on his BBQ dish or helix.
> Or ask for multiple repeats when their own signal is near beacon level. As a
> starting point a BBQ dish works, but it should not be what we as a group
> acknowledge as adequate.

My point is that a BBQ dish works well enough and you don't have to be near
the beacon level to hear yourself or others.  It's not the best and yes, I
am looking to improve on it, but it works.  Obviously, in your mind, my
results just aren't valid.  If you cannot hear well with a BBQ dish, perhaps
there is something else wrong.  I am quite surprised at how well it does do
after reading how much trouble I would have with it.  Which is why this is
all good humor when guys like you tell me I am not hearing well!

Nothing will convince you of what I hear or how well.  Perhaps I should make
some audio recordings and send them to you.  Of course, you'll just say that
they were all stations that were as strong as the beacon that I heard.
Never mind the beacon being 6 to 8 S units above the stations I hear.  But
then again, my radio's S meter must have a total dynamic range of about 2


Jon Ogden
NA9D (ex: KE9NA)

Citizen of the People's Democratic Republik of Illinois

Life Member: ARRL, NRA
Member:  AMSAT, DXCC

http://www.qsl.net/na9d   <- Updated on 1/22/03!!!

"A life lived in fear is a life half lived."

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