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Re: was TS-2000X, now AO-40 lids

on 2/4/03 8:37 AM, Andrew Glasbrenner at glasbrenner@mindspring.com wrote:

>> Oh yeah, I'm one of those people who are running a BBQ dish.  >I'm not
>> supposed to be able to hear well....Yet, I hear fine.  Work >stations all
>> the
>> time when squints are above 20 degrees.
> You only think you hear well. I used a BBQ dish for a while, and now use a 3ft
> solid prime focus. BBQ dishes are ok to start with, but ARE NOT optimal. I
> talked to 3-4 guys this weekend who thought AO-40 was a dud because they
> couldn't hear it well enough on their BBQ dishes. Watch the swap boards and
> see how many $300 converters mated to useless antennas turn up for sale.

I never said it was optimal and I plan on improving it.  But yet, here is
another person who thinks he knows what I hear.  It's amazing!  Perhaps
people think it's a dud because they expect it to sound like their local
repeater.  I cut my teeth in satellites on AO-10 a few years ago where
signals had a lot of fade and tended to be very weak.  I routinely work DX
on HF and pileups in contests where stations are below the noise floor of my
rx.  I have no problem hearing anyone on AO-40.  Sheesh!  I love  how people
tell me I can't hear.  I just love it.
>> In my experience on AO-40, I find VERY few people running >anywhere near
>> the
>> beacon.  Supposedly, the "experts" say that a BBQ dish doesn't >cut it.
>> Well, it does.  I get the beacon very loud and can work >stations down to
>> the
>> noise floor.  Most stations are a couple dB above the noise >floor but they
>> are WAY more than 10 dB below the beacon.  I've never heard >anyone calling
>> CQ on top of the beacon.  It's so loud, I can't believe anyone >with any
>> kind
>> of S band antenna can't hear it.
> There is no way you hear the "satellite" noise floor on a standard BBQ dish
> setup.

I never said the satellite noise floor.  I am talking about my noise floor.
And if there are stations who are just above the satellite noise floor, then
they are running too little power, IMHO.  Oh yeah, we gotta  be Boy Scouts.
Don't be 10 dB below the beacon, be 20 or 40 dB below it.  That's the idea.

> stations +-3 db of the beacon, on CW, SSB, and especially on SSTV. The CW
> really pumps the AGC too, and the ops usually don't hear Leila because of
> their filters. The first rule of amateur satellites is being able to hear! Why
> are people willing to put up 20 ft long Mode B/J antennas, but not a 3ft dish?

First of all, SSTV ops tend to be of the lid nature to begin with.  Give a
listen to 14.230 some time.  They think they OWN that frequency and
everything for 5 kHz on either side.  So that doesn't surprise me.

The CW shouldn't pump the AGC like it does.  That's one of my points in that
I think the U band receive just doesn't perform as well as L band.

How are you measuring the +/- 3 dB?  By ear?  Pretty hard to do or do you
have test equipment.  And as for the don't hear Leila thing, I find that
hard to believe.  Most satellite rigs don't have super great filtering.
Besides Leila notches your signal so even if you don't hear the tones, you
should be able to hear that your downlink is not there.

Yet why am I even talking and discussing this.  I obviously can't hear a
damn thing on AO-40 according to all you experts and so I must be one of
these lids!  Cripe.  What a great way to encourage people to use the bird.

Your efforts have worked so well that on a good pass above the USA last
night there were maybe 4 Qs that I heard going on.  Oh gee, they must have
all been lids running too much power since I can't hear well.  All the other
users were under my receiver's noise floor and I was calling CQ on top of
them.  Yeah, that's it.  If I believed you.  And my S-meter which reads the
beacon at S8 must be totally non-linear and the stations I hear at S1 to S3
are really only 3 dB below the beacon.

Yet, it's funny.  I've had QSOs with a couple of guys who have had spectrum
analyzers on their signals to monitor their strength (and mine) relative to
the beacon.  Just the other day this happened.  I was peaking around S-2 on
my S meter and the other station told me I was better than 10 dB below the
beacon.  I heard just fine.

I just love the self righteousness of this group!


Jon Ogden
NA9D (ex: KE9NA)

Citizen of the People's Democratic Republik of Illinois

Life Member: ARRL, NRA
Member:  AMSAT, DXCC

http://www.qsl.net/na9d   <- Updated on 1/22/03!!!

"A life lived in fear is a life half lived."

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